' false it's called critting. | Posted by HopTortoise on Apr 21, 2013, 10:03:06 PM |
To OP: Look for Tulaa physical/crit build. With 6 or 7 frenzy charges and EB, DPS at around 10k, if I recall correctly. I'll probably delete my LA-chain/static blows ranger to start one based on the Tulaa build. | Posted by shaokim on Apr 21, 2013, 10:08:59 PM |
I'd rather ask why not make a physical ranger? First off, rangers should be a physical class which I myself chose to go physical instead. Second of all, with enough crit a physical ranger has as good dps as an elemental one. Lastly, I think this game has way too many LA archers running around just because they are op and easy to handle. | Posted by Kiluvaras on Apr 21, 2013, 10:17:21 PM |
I agree that physical is easier on melee than bow - look at the support gems for physical dmg - all for melee. I'm trying to run a puncture/poison bow build but it's proving hard to get enough dmg and not sacrifice defences completely | Posted by on Apr 21, 2013, 10:34:04 PM |
I run a physical ranger, and it's fine, plus you don't have hardware lag from all those lighting arrows, and have a lot of life steal. It's cheaper to gear with pure phisical bows beeing cheeper. I played with him up to lvl 72 maps solo no problem in full iq(120)/ir(240) gear and gems. Anarchy @legion_cierpienia, @Ryder_or_Riot Contact through forum if you like something that I don't bump. | Posted by lososthefish on Apr 21, 2013, 10:38:38 PM |
' It's the same problem that all phys dps builds encounter. Crit is absolute shit. If you get every crit node available, it's just okay, and you can't get the necessary life nodes. As neat as the passive tree looks, all that matters for phys builds is health. If they tripled the base crit on bows then phys would be better but still inferior to ele. As it is now, phys is absolute shit unless you want to farm the ledge until level 80 | Posted by on Apr 21, 2013, 10:47:44 PM |
I have a physical ranger.. Does 1k physical per arrow with 35% chance to crit @ 500% increased crit multiplier and 100% chance to pierce (@ 4+ attacks / s).. Also to the oh so very informed OP.. 1 - Belts do have +% physical mods. I have a few rare ones. 2 - There are a TON of physical bow damage nodes.. No idea what you're talking about. Both +projectile damage nodes AND +bow physical damage nodes all add to physical damage in the end. Basically there are more nodes to increase physical damage than there are to increase elemental damage within the ranger tree -.- 3 - I would never use LA with a physical build.. Maybe a hybrid but never a pure physical. Use physical skills like Frenzy, Rain of Arrows, or Split Arrow. I also run massive %life leech and %mana leech so I never have mana problems nor does physical reflect really hurt me much. As for which does more end game. Assuming enemies have an armor of A and you do D damage (physical) per arrow Damage mitigation % = A / (A + 12*D)) Damage per arrow after mitigation = (1 - damage mitigation)*D = [1 - (A / (A + 12*D))]*(D) Assuming enemies have a resistance R and you do D damage (elemental) per arrow, you want to find out when (D)*[1 - (A / (A + 12*D))] > (D)*(1 - R) Do some maths. (I'm assuming ele and phys dmg are the same so I'm using the same D). [(1 /R) - 1]*(1/12) < D/A If you assume monsters have 40% resistance, the break even point is when you do 12.5% of the monster's armor. If you assume the end game armor is ~8000, then the break even point is ~1k damage. So if you do 1k+ physical damage per shot end game, you will end up doing more damage compared to the same elemental damage. If you do less, however, effective elemental damage will be higher. This is why making a physical crit build becomes more effective than an elemental build. If you crit every 3 shots for 5X your damage, you're effective damage is proportionally MUCH higher. If you do as I do and run a split arrow + 100% chance to pierce.. every 3 shots you crit on EVERY arrow fired and the entire crowd is crit hit. For comparisons: Lets say both our effective damage is 1k before mitigation (LA is using lmp + chain) and for some reason the LA archer has 30% crit chance @500% mult and for simplicity, out of 3 shots, 1 crits and 2 don't: LA dmg = (3 arrows + 6 chains)*(1k/arrow)*(2 casts) + (3 arrows + 6 chains)*(1k/arrow)*(5)*(1 shot) = 9*1k*2 + 9*1k*1*5 = 18000 + 45000 = > 63 000 (before damage mitigation) > 37 8000 (after 40% resistance mitigation) Split arrow = (6 arrows + 3 pierces)*(1k/arrow)*(2 casts) + (6 arrows + 3 pierces)*(1k/arrow)*(5)*(1 shot) = 9*1k*2 + 9*1k*5*1 = 18000 + 45000 => 63 000 (before damage mitigation) Calculating the damage mitigation is a pain in the ass since you have to do it per arrow.. @1k damage => mitigation = (8000 / (8000 + 12000)) = 0.4 => 600 9*600*2 = 10800 @5k damage => mitigation = (8000 / 8000 + 12*5000) = 0.12 => 882 9*882*1*5 = 39690 Total physical after mitigation = 10800 + 39690 = 50 490 Thus, on average, @30% crit and 500% mult: Split arrow => 50 490 damage VS Lighting arrow => 37 800 damage Now imagine adding a small amount of cold damage to split arrow.. you basically do more damage and perma freeze mobs. Also. LA is laggy as fuck. Last edited by Worgasm on Apr 21, 2013, 10:57:33 PM | Posted by on Apr 21, 2013, 10:52:39 PM |
Well, I'm playing one right now. It's a CI Crit Duelist (Vaal Pact + Ghost Reaver + Arrow Dodging). It's working relatively well - yes the damage is admittedly low compared to elemental/elemental conversion, but physical was necessary for leech. In any case, like others have stated, there's a ton of elemental resistant enemies vs very few physical resistant. So while the tooltips are lower, the damage is still workable (for solo play). IGN: MonopolyLegend How high does this thing stack?! | Posted by on Apr 21, 2013, 11:15:14 PM |
' Your argument is stupid. You probably fall over if the wind blows too hard. While you were taking all of those crit nodes, my LA was grabbing health/regen/res, without having to rely on the Skill Tree for damage. With Glare/Mali's/Rat's Nest, my LA crits hard too, and I didn't have to throw away node points trying to percentage increase build based on 5%.Now I have 7600 Life and still do more damage than you. With JUST the health nodes and my Kaom's, I am durable enough to run mf in every single other slot when I want, and still clear 70+ maps in 10 minutes. I honestly can't believe that you tried to argue that phys Ranger > LA Ranger. You will edit your post when you sober up. | Posted by on Apr 21, 2013, 11:33:37 PM |
Well, I am not saying physical bow build is totally garbage or not viable, I am just stating some facts. 1. No strength bonus unless you pick Iron Grip ( and sorry I thought it applies to projectiles, I was mistaken ) 2. No ' more physical damage ' gem. 3. No % physical damage increase from belts or quivers. Damage wise, it seems no brainer to me to choose elemental build. Defense wise, I don't know. While you can leech good amount of hp without wasting a support gem for it, you will lack some serious dps. ' 1. I really wanna see your %inc physical damage rare belt :) 2. Why spend shit loads of passives to physical damage while you can easily spend like 10 in templar area and also have access to inner force and maybe static blows? I am not sure about mobs' armor or resistances though because I didn't see any explanation from devs about it. Anyway, even if all the mobs had no armor and max resistances, I still think that elemental will deal more dps :) | Posted by zekerferc on Apr 21, 2013, 11:35:59 PM |